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Our school system continues to go down. What is a good answer to this problem? Kids dropping out of school is never a good thing but 1 million a year on average. Are families failing or is it our schools or both? http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,344190,00.html

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Suzy Richardson,

this answer and the bimbo answer could be the same thing almost. It all goes back to the parents. The schools can only do so much with the kids. The teachers can only give what the kids will take and only have them for 6 hours on a good day (in elementary school) by the time you get the music classes, gym, lunch, recess, etc out of the way. The parents however, have the children longer. Also - a huge thing I see - is the lack of teaching at home. How many of your children knew how to count to 10, colors and abc's by the time they got to kindergarten. My kids don't. My niece - at 19 months - can count to 5. I was working with a 5 year old last year who couldn't count to 10. The parents of many of our children don't read to their kids, they don't work with their kids, they don't spend time with their kids. It's normal life to many of us but not to everyone to work with their children. To read books to their children when they're young. The idea of "NO child left behind" is a great concept!!! The problem is - it HAS To start in the home BEFORE the kids even enter preschool. The most teachable years are 0-3 years old.

Yes - there are some teachers out there that need to retire and they need to ban tenure in my opinion - but - for the most part - you can follow the drop out rates directly up to the parents -or lack there of.

I think it's a combination of both parents and schools. I think the parents need to be more involved and I think the schools need to do more to make the kids feel safe in school. I know many kids who have been bullied throughout the years they are in school, so as soon as they are old enough they want out. I have a friend whose son is teased relentlessly and they school keeps telling my friend that they can't do anything because these kids aren't physically touching her child. But that also goes back to these kids parents teaching right from wrong. My youngest just turned 3 and he can count to 20 (and even to 10 in spanish...thank you Dora..haha) But we also use an online public school..so I have my daughter at home teaching her and he picks up on a lot of that. I think what it boils down to, is that there needs to be more communication and cooperation between parents and schools...they need to learn to really work together.

I certainly think that the parents have a major role and responsiblity when it comes to their child finishing high school. If they aren't involved, the child will not feel that their education is important.

I don't always love the way things are done at my kids' school; and I do think that sometimes teachers could do more, but for me, I think it is ultimately the parents' responsibility. If my kid is struggling in school, I don't think it is up to the teacher to fix the problem, I think it is up to me. I think that a lot of people send their kids to school and just expect the school to do everything. That is a mistake and the kids will end up paying. So, even though the schools have to take responsibility for things, I think that the foundation that is set for a child in the home is what ultimately counts the most.

I think you hit it on the mark Suzy! We can't rely upon teachers/schools to do it all. If our child is struggling it is our responsibility to make sure they get the help they need. We've become a blame everybody else society. We need to start taking responsibility for our own actions and for the actions of our children.

yes the home and parents have a good amount to do with with the children's education. However in my experience with the school my son is in, I have tried to work with the teacher and I dont always get full cooperation.
She even told me that grades don't really matter!! I couldn't believe it! I was floored. I feel like my son is not held to the same expectations that I have of him at home. I get the excuse from the teacher that she has so many kids in the classroom, blah, blah blah.
And then I was being told that he wasn't paying attention in reading. But what they failed to tell me was that the regular reading teacher (which is different from his homeroom teacher) fell ill in Nov and they had substitutes for over 3 months! No wonder he wasn't doing well in reading.
Sorry, didn't mean to make this my personal rant. but I do think there are schools with our own county that need some work!

I absolutely agree with you, myspirit. My son has this one teacher who is so unorganized that it is even difficult for me (a grown-up) to figure out what is going on and when. All of his other teachers seem okay, so I have kind of had to let this one slide because it was really pushing me over the edge. He probably won't get much from this teacher, but I guess we have to deal with it being a public school and all. It is SUPER frustrating.

I can only speak for the schools that I'm involved with here in Michigan but I can say it from a few different perspectives. I've substitute taught for 6 months in one - toughest thing I"ve done ina LONG time! I never could figure out why the teachers were so tired by the end of the day - until I was put in their shoes. I knew 90% of the kids in the school before going into the classroom and they all new my expectations and my behavioral demands. I still was exhausted. You are giving 110% all day long and the kids that I"m involved with suck you dry. You are spent by the end of the day if you're a good teacher.

Myspirit - the fact that the teacher might have so many in her room is true - it's hard to give attention to 25 (15 would be an ideal classroom and many in the US have in the high 20's)kids - if you can imagine having that many children. That's what a good teacher does - those students are her children. On top of the sheer numbers - in the classrooms in my schools - the grade level abilities in one classroom range 4-5 grades. For example - there is a 3rd grade classroom in which one student is at a 5th grade reading level, another student gets sent to 4th grade for math becuase he's so smart in math, there are 6 students in need of resource (or classified as special ed) but only get that for maybe 1 1/2 hours a day - then they're back in the main classroom lost as ever AND on the other end of the spectrum - there is a student who does not even know his letter sounds - not to mention the basic words to read of and, the, run, etc.

So - how do you go about teaching a student who doesn't have the abilities to know what sound the letter L makes AND a student who is reading 2 levels above their grade level at one time? On top of all this - there are SEVERAL behavioral issues becuase there is lack of parenting and expectations at home for most of the kids.

I can walk into a classroom and generally within 1 hour of observing and maybe doing an activity with the class - tell you which ones have active parents and which ones don't.

So - which child suffers becuase of the way the US sets up their schools? The one who doesn't know letter sounds in 3rd grade? Or the one at the 5th grade reading level??

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I can walk into a classroom and generally within 1 hour of observing and maybe doing an activity with the class - tell you which ones have active parents and which ones don't.

Wow. Really? That is something, isn't it? I am really glad that you gave your perspective as a teacher. Is it really that obvious when the parents are not involved? How exactly can you tell? Is it behavior? Is it appearance? What is it?

I'm not a teacher, but just visiting my daughter's classroom every so often I can tell who's parent's aren't active. In her classroom it's everything...it's appearance, it's behavior, it's grades etc. etc. You wouldn't believe how many kids go to school with their hair a mess and mis-matched or dirty clothing. These kids aren't just from low income households either. Some of these parents are dressed to the hilt in designer clothing but they could care less what their child goes to school looking like. And what exactly is the motivation for a child to get good grades if their parents don't praise them for the good work they've done? It's really sad.

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I can walk into a classroom and generally within 1 hour of observing and maybe doing an activity with the class - tell you which ones have active parents and which ones don't.

i don't think that is a fair statement. i am a very involved parent but my son has issues behaving in school. his teacher and i meet regularly, she is a god send. he is the one that has to be told to sit down 10 times and he is the one that finishes his work and then distracts the kid next to him.

i do not believe anyone can draw any conclusion based on a one hour observation in any environment.

my personal belief is that the schools are spending too much time trying to save the kids that don't get what they need at home. i'm sorry if that offends some but it is true. my daughter has to fight for attention as an advanced student. she says the only time anyone hears from the principal is when they are in trouble and he is always busy.

don't get me wrong, i believe all students deserve a fair chance but i have a hard time with teachers telling me they don't have time to take my daughter to the next level because they have to spend so much time working with the kids that are behind. i'm so thankful for high school and classes split based on ability/level. finally, my daughter is being challenged by teachers who seem excited to be with kids that are interested in learning.

softballmom,
You don't offend me at all. I love being able to debate and hear other's opinions. That is what my posts are - strictly MY opinion - and I'll be the first to admit - I don't know everything.

However - this is the world that we all live in and your daugther who is advanced doesn't get the attention - it sucks!!! I totally agree - but it's because she doesn't need the help to be on grade level. Is that right? Absolutely not! but it is the way a lot of school systems are ran.

I HATE the split classrooms because in OUR district - they don't split by abilities - they split the kids up - giving each class some bad ones and some good ones.

AND - my conclusions are not based on the number of times a kid has to be told to sit down. Trust me - MOST kids have to be told to sit down. My evaluation is more based on how the student would interact with their classmates, their language abilities, their ways they formulate ideas, their manners, etc. Not who can't sit still in their seats. I have trouble with that some days and I"m pushing 40! It's from experience of working with many kids who don't have the parental involvement and then seeing the kids who do. You can tell in a very short time when kids are in a relationship with their parent. I was in a situation a few weeks ago where a 22 mo old (who had NEVER seen me before and I look very different than most who come to his door) wanted me to hold him - and then proceded to give me a kiss on the cheek. Most people - would think how sweet and precious! He's so loving. When in reality - this little boy does that becuase he doesn't have any attachment to his mother. For whatever reason he has not bonded with her. Children will attach to anyone who gives them attention if they do not have any sort of bond with a parent. There is a whole lot of a story in that house and I"m just starting to learn about it.

I hope this doesn't offend you or anyone else too - I think there is a HUGE issue with our school systems and it will take people like us - who are passionate about their children getting the best education they can - to change the way things are going! I personally LOVE hearing about others who are as passionate as I am - even if we don't agree 100%!

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Originally posted by Casmly:
I'm not a teacher, but just visiting my daughter's classroom every so often I can tell who's parent's aren't active. In her classroom it's everything...it's appearance, it's behavior, it's grades etc. etc.

Ok, I'll buy this...you said you visit the classroom often. that's a lot more than one hour.

but still, until you've met the parents, it is wrong to form such judgements. i'm very involved but what you described, the kid with mismatched clothes, that's my son. he could care less. my daughter is dress to the hilt. they come from the same home, same mom.

i wish we could do an experiment and have some of you observe my son and my daughter, not knowing they were mine or even related. you would draw two very distinct differt opinions of who or what you thought their parent was like.

i too believe parents play the biggest role, but until you've met with the parent, you really shouldn't judge. especially things like this child has no attachment to his mother...

Ok, maybe mismatched was a bad term to use. You are certainly right, there are kids who don't care or kids that are more independent than others who just don't match. For me though it's really a culmination of behavior, dress etc. And, as Hoodmama explained the number of times a kid is told to sit down or to focus is not necessarily a testament to their home life either.

As one example...My daughter has a friend that was in her class in kindergarten and now in first grade. I visited the classroom a couple of times during her kindergarten year and had a chance to observe this girl. Her hair did not look as if it was brushed (at least not by an adult) and she looked generally unkempt. Her clothing might match, it might not, but it didn't look as if the parent took any care at all to ensure that she looked appropriate prior to leaving the house. I guess it's kind of hard to explain without really being there, but I just knew somehow that her parents didn't/weren't able to spend the time they needed to with her. My daughter has since come to me on multiple occasions complaining about how clingy her friend is. She doesn't like Jordan to play with anyone else but her, and will break down and cry if she does (even when she is invited to play too). I've since found out that the girl's parents are divorced and it appears that she gets lost in the mess of brothers/sisters/step brothers and sisters. (And BELIEVE me I am not saying it isn't possible to take proper care of your child during/after a divorce.) That's only one example.

I agree that it is wrong to judge a parent without having met them. Although I myself take a mental note of which children SEEM to lack their parent's attention, I do not assume that their parents are not involved until I find out otherwise. And even then, all situations are different. There are perfectly good parents out there that are having to work around the clock to put food on the table for their children. I'm sure there are other situations as well that make it difficult for parents to put in the extra effort with their student that will ensure that they thrive.